Tiny humanoids?











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There are many tiny humanoids in fiction, the Arquilians of Men in Black, the Gargantians of Buzz Lightyear Star Command and a few others. This raises the question, is it possible for a humanoid species to evolve to be so small?



enter image description here



Let's try to stick to natural evolution only and no tiny machine sentient entities.










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  • 1




    Hello Joe. This question would be better asked as a part of our anatomically correct series.
    – JBH
    4 hours ago















up vote
2
down vote

favorite












There are many tiny humanoids in fiction, the Arquilians of Men in Black, the Gargantians of Buzz Lightyear Star Command and a few others. This raises the question, is it possible for a humanoid species to evolve to be so small?



enter image description here



Let's try to stick to natural evolution only and no tiny machine sentient entities.










share|improve this question




















  • 1




    Hello Joe. This question would be better asked as a part of our anatomically correct series.
    – JBH
    4 hours ago













up vote
2
down vote

favorite









up vote
2
down vote

favorite











There are many tiny humanoids in fiction, the Arquilians of Men in Black, the Gargantians of Buzz Lightyear Star Command and a few others. This raises the question, is it possible for a humanoid species to evolve to be so small?



enter image description here



Let's try to stick to natural evolution only and no tiny machine sentient entities.










share|improve this question















There are many tiny humanoids in fiction, the Arquilians of Men in Black, the Gargantians of Buzz Lightyear Star Command and a few others. This raises the question, is it possible for a humanoid species to evolve to be so small?



enter image description here



Let's try to stick to natural evolution only and no tiny machine sentient entities.







evolution aliens humanoid






share|improve this question















share|improve this question













share|improve this question




share|improve this question








edited 4 hours ago









L.Dutch

74k24178356




74k24178356










asked 6 hours ago









Joe Smith

866




866








  • 1




    Hello Joe. This question would be better asked as a part of our anatomically correct series.
    – JBH
    4 hours ago














  • 1




    Hello Joe. This question would be better asked as a part of our anatomically correct series.
    – JBH
    4 hours ago








1




1




Hello Joe. This question would be better asked as a part of our anatomically correct series.
– JBH
4 hours ago




Hello Joe. This question would be better asked as a part of our anatomically correct series.
– JBH
4 hours ago










3 Answers
3






active

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up vote
3
down vote














  1. Can primates be very small and live an independent existence?


Answer: Yes, for example the Pygmy Marmoset. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pygmy_marmoset



enter image description here




  1. Can humans be very small?


Answer: They can certainly be small. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_the_verified_shortest_people



enter image description here



NOTE - At this point I have to attend to real life so will have to continue this later.






share|improve this answer




























    up vote
    2
    down vote













    There are two implicit questions here:




    1. Are there any physical factors about humanoid bodies that prevent functioning at that scale.

    2. Can a creature that small be intelligent


    Mammals come in a range of sizes, all the way from tiny (the Etruscan Shrew weighs 1.8g) to huge (an African elephant can weigh 6 tons), so a human's fundamental biology seems like it shouldn't have issues. However, you will notice that all small animals tend to use all four limbs for motion. Even squirrels with relatively dexterous hands use them while running. I think this is because as you get smaller, terrain gets relatively larger. As a result, the smaller an animal is, the better it has to be at climbing, and at small scales this probably favours claws over gripping-fingers.



    The other question is one of intelligence. Can a small creature be sapient? Well, this is an impossible question to answer really, because we can't really figure out what it is that makes humans different to animals from an intelligence perspective. Some thing that may offer clues is the brain-body-mass ratio. Man definitely falls near the upper end of that, and you can see a definite increase of "intelligence" as the brain mass increases. However, even animals with brains 5-6 times heavier than humans don't seem as intelligent. And on the other end of the scale, the Portia spider has a body 5mm long (and so a head that is extremely tiny), and yet it exhibits the ability to "hunt in ways that seem intelligent". This includes the ability to plan routes to prey that take it out of visual contact.

    I have a theory that the physical form of an animal dictates it's intelligence. I think that (given an evolutionistic model), any creature with sufficiently dexterous manipulators, sufficient perception fidelity, and with the ability to communicate with others of it's species should be able to become intelligent given enough bootstrapping time. So if you had a miniature humanoid creature and left it for long enough, that theory states that the creature will become intelligent.



    So in short: I can't see any reasons why it wouldn't be plausible.






    share|improve this answer






























      up vote
      0
      down vote













      I'm not sure how small we're talking, but take a look at chimpanzees.



      Now if you had a chimpanzee become more intelligent (i.e. more synapses and more oxygen-rich blood flowing to the brain, as well as heat dispersion), for reasons such as gaining an advantage over other species or navigating complex and ever-changing environments, it would be quite imaginable.



      The main issue I spot is heat dispersion, since the surface area is considerably small when compared to the volume of the head. Some of the heat may be transported through the blood, perhaps leading to large ears (such as in African elephants or desert foxes) or tongues (thing panting dogs) to dissipate the heat.



      A more exotic solution might be to shape the skull in such a way as to increase the surface area, perhaps with deep wrinkles or folds, though this may come with structural integrity issues, and will not transport the heat in the center to the surface very quickly. It may also impede the room for the organs, perhaps even causing a split brain for a U-shaped skull.



      Other than that I don't see a problem whatsoever.



      EDIT: I'm completely wrong as pointed out in the comments, it's the larger the animal the harder it is to manage heat. Pity though, may have been interesting.






      share|improve this answer










      New contributor




      A Lambent Eye is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.














      • 1




        So that's what the wrinkles on Klingon's foreheads are! They're cooling fins for the mighty warrior brain!
        – Elmy
        3 hours ago










      • Actually for small animals the issue is NOT dissipating too much heat. The surface/volume ration goes like 1/r thus it gets higher as r gets smaller.
        – L.Dutch
        1 hour ago










      • Argh, I got it mixed up! Thanks for pointing it out.
        – A Lambent Eye
        51 mins ago











      Your Answer





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      3 Answers
      3






      active

      oldest

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      3 Answers
      3






      active

      oldest

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      active

      oldest

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      active

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      up vote
      3
      down vote














      1. Can primates be very small and live an independent existence?


      Answer: Yes, for example the Pygmy Marmoset. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pygmy_marmoset



      enter image description here




      1. Can humans be very small?


      Answer: They can certainly be small. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_the_verified_shortest_people



      enter image description here



      NOTE - At this point I have to attend to real life so will have to continue this later.






      share|improve this answer

























        up vote
        3
        down vote














        1. Can primates be very small and live an independent existence?


        Answer: Yes, for example the Pygmy Marmoset. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pygmy_marmoset



        enter image description here




        1. Can humans be very small?


        Answer: They can certainly be small. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_the_verified_shortest_people



        enter image description here



        NOTE - At this point I have to attend to real life so will have to continue this later.






        share|improve this answer























          up vote
          3
          down vote










          up vote
          3
          down vote










          1. Can primates be very small and live an independent existence?


          Answer: Yes, for example the Pygmy Marmoset. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pygmy_marmoset



          enter image description here




          1. Can humans be very small?


          Answer: They can certainly be small. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_the_verified_shortest_people



          enter image description here



          NOTE - At this point I have to attend to real life so will have to continue this later.






          share|improve this answer













          1. Can primates be very small and live an independent existence?


          Answer: Yes, for example the Pygmy Marmoset. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pygmy_marmoset



          enter image description here




          1. Can humans be very small?


          Answer: They can certainly be small. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_the_verified_shortest_people



          enter image description here



          NOTE - At this point I have to attend to real life so will have to continue this later.







          share|improve this answer












          share|improve this answer



          share|improve this answer










          answered 3 hours ago









          chasly from UK

          11.1k349103




          11.1k349103






















              up vote
              2
              down vote













              There are two implicit questions here:




              1. Are there any physical factors about humanoid bodies that prevent functioning at that scale.

              2. Can a creature that small be intelligent


              Mammals come in a range of sizes, all the way from tiny (the Etruscan Shrew weighs 1.8g) to huge (an African elephant can weigh 6 tons), so a human's fundamental biology seems like it shouldn't have issues. However, you will notice that all small animals tend to use all four limbs for motion. Even squirrels with relatively dexterous hands use them while running. I think this is because as you get smaller, terrain gets relatively larger. As a result, the smaller an animal is, the better it has to be at climbing, and at small scales this probably favours claws over gripping-fingers.



              The other question is one of intelligence. Can a small creature be sapient? Well, this is an impossible question to answer really, because we can't really figure out what it is that makes humans different to animals from an intelligence perspective. Some thing that may offer clues is the brain-body-mass ratio. Man definitely falls near the upper end of that, and you can see a definite increase of "intelligence" as the brain mass increases. However, even animals with brains 5-6 times heavier than humans don't seem as intelligent. And on the other end of the scale, the Portia spider has a body 5mm long (and so a head that is extremely tiny), and yet it exhibits the ability to "hunt in ways that seem intelligent". This includes the ability to plan routes to prey that take it out of visual contact.

              I have a theory that the physical form of an animal dictates it's intelligence. I think that (given an evolutionistic model), any creature with sufficiently dexterous manipulators, sufficient perception fidelity, and with the ability to communicate with others of it's species should be able to become intelligent given enough bootstrapping time. So if you had a miniature humanoid creature and left it for long enough, that theory states that the creature will become intelligent.



              So in short: I can't see any reasons why it wouldn't be plausible.






              share|improve this answer



























                up vote
                2
                down vote













                There are two implicit questions here:




                1. Are there any physical factors about humanoid bodies that prevent functioning at that scale.

                2. Can a creature that small be intelligent


                Mammals come in a range of sizes, all the way from tiny (the Etruscan Shrew weighs 1.8g) to huge (an African elephant can weigh 6 tons), so a human's fundamental biology seems like it shouldn't have issues. However, you will notice that all small animals tend to use all four limbs for motion. Even squirrels with relatively dexterous hands use them while running. I think this is because as you get smaller, terrain gets relatively larger. As a result, the smaller an animal is, the better it has to be at climbing, and at small scales this probably favours claws over gripping-fingers.



                The other question is one of intelligence. Can a small creature be sapient? Well, this is an impossible question to answer really, because we can't really figure out what it is that makes humans different to animals from an intelligence perspective. Some thing that may offer clues is the brain-body-mass ratio. Man definitely falls near the upper end of that, and you can see a definite increase of "intelligence" as the brain mass increases. However, even animals with brains 5-6 times heavier than humans don't seem as intelligent. And on the other end of the scale, the Portia spider has a body 5mm long (and so a head that is extremely tiny), and yet it exhibits the ability to "hunt in ways that seem intelligent". This includes the ability to plan routes to prey that take it out of visual contact.

                I have a theory that the physical form of an animal dictates it's intelligence. I think that (given an evolutionistic model), any creature with sufficiently dexterous manipulators, sufficient perception fidelity, and with the ability to communicate with others of it's species should be able to become intelligent given enough bootstrapping time. So if you had a miniature humanoid creature and left it for long enough, that theory states that the creature will become intelligent.



                So in short: I can't see any reasons why it wouldn't be plausible.






                share|improve this answer

























                  up vote
                  2
                  down vote










                  up vote
                  2
                  down vote









                  There are two implicit questions here:




                  1. Are there any physical factors about humanoid bodies that prevent functioning at that scale.

                  2. Can a creature that small be intelligent


                  Mammals come in a range of sizes, all the way from tiny (the Etruscan Shrew weighs 1.8g) to huge (an African elephant can weigh 6 tons), so a human's fundamental biology seems like it shouldn't have issues. However, you will notice that all small animals tend to use all four limbs for motion. Even squirrels with relatively dexterous hands use them while running. I think this is because as you get smaller, terrain gets relatively larger. As a result, the smaller an animal is, the better it has to be at climbing, and at small scales this probably favours claws over gripping-fingers.



                  The other question is one of intelligence. Can a small creature be sapient? Well, this is an impossible question to answer really, because we can't really figure out what it is that makes humans different to animals from an intelligence perspective. Some thing that may offer clues is the brain-body-mass ratio. Man definitely falls near the upper end of that, and you can see a definite increase of "intelligence" as the brain mass increases. However, even animals with brains 5-6 times heavier than humans don't seem as intelligent. And on the other end of the scale, the Portia spider has a body 5mm long (and so a head that is extremely tiny), and yet it exhibits the ability to "hunt in ways that seem intelligent". This includes the ability to plan routes to prey that take it out of visual contact.

                  I have a theory that the physical form of an animal dictates it's intelligence. I think that (given an evolutionistic model), any creature with sufficiently dexterous manipulators, sufficient perception fidelity, and with the ability to communicate with others of it's species should be able to become intelligent given enough bootstrapping time. So if you had a miniature humanoid creature and left it for long enough, that theory states that the creature will become intelligent.



                  So in short: I can't see any reasons why it wouldn't be plausible.






                  share|improve this answer














                  There are two implicit questions here:




                  1. Are there any physical factors about humanoid bodies that prevent functioning at that scale.

                  2. Can a creature that small be intelligent


                  Mammals come in a range of sizes, all the way from tiny (the Etruscan Shrew weighs 1.8g) to huge (an African elephant can weigh 6 tons), so a human's fundamental biology seems like it shouldn't have issues. However, you will notice that all small animals tend to use all four limbs for motion. Even squirrels with relatively dexterous hands use them while running. I think this is because as you get smaller, terrain gets relatively larger. As a result, the smaller an animal is, the better it has to be at climbing, and at small scales this probably favours claws over gripping-fingers.



                  The other question is one of intelligence. Can a small creature be sapient? Well, this is an impossible question to answer really, because we can't really figure out what it is that makes humans different to animals from an intelligence perspective. Some thing that may offer clues is the brain-body-mass ratio. Man definitely falls near the upper end of that, and you can see a definite increase of "intelligence" as the brain mass increases. However, even animals with brains 5-6 times heavier than humans don't seem as intelligent. And on the other end of the scale, the Portia spider has a body 5mm long (and so a head that is extremely tiny), and yet it exhibits the ability to "hunt in ways that seem intelligent". This includes the ability to plan routes to prey that take it out of visual contact.

                  I have a theory that the physical form of an animal dictates it's intelligence. I think that (given an evolutionistic model), any creature with sufficiently dexterous manipulators, sufficient perception fidelity, and with the ability to communicate with others of it's species should be able to become intelligent given enough bootstrapping time. So if you had a miniature humanoid creature and left it for long enough, that theory states that the creature will become intelligent.



                  So in short: I can't see any reasons why it wouldn't be plausible.







                  share|improve this answer














                  share|improve this answer



                  share|improve this answer








                  edited 29 mins ago









                  Renan

                  41.6k1196212




                  41.6k1196212










                  answered 2 hours ago









                  sdfgeoff

                  2,748216




                  2,748216






















                      up vote
                      0
                      down vote













                      I'm not sure how small we're talking, but take a look at chimpanzees.



                      Now if you had a chimpanzee become more intelligent (i.e. more synapses and more oxygen-rich blood flowing to the brain, as well as heat dispersion), for reasons such as gaining an advantage over other species or navigating complex and ever-changing environments, it would be quite imaginable.



                      The main issue I spot is heat dispersion, since the surface area is considerably small when compared to the volume of the head. Some of the heat may be transported through the blood, perhaps leading to large ears (such as in African elephants or desert foxes) or tongues (thing panting dogs) to dissipate the heat.



                      A more exotic solution might be to shape the skull in such a way as to increase the surface area, perhaps with deep wrinkles or folds, though this may come with structural integrity issues, and will not transport the heat in the center to the surface very quickly. It may also impede the room for the organs, perhaps even causing a split brain for a U-shaped skull.



                      Other than that I don't see a problem whatsoever.



                      EDIT: I'm completely wrong as pointed out in the comments, it's the larger the animal the harder it is to manage heat. Pity though, may have been interesting.






                      share|improve this answer










                      New contributor




                      A Lambent Eye is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                      Check out our Code of Conduct.














                      • 1




                        So that's what the wrinkles on Klingon's foreheads are! They're cooling fins for the mighty warrior brain!
                        – Elmy
                        3 hours ago










                      • Actually for small animals the issue is NOT dissipating too much heat. The surface/volume ration goes like 1/r thus it gets higher as r gets smaller.
                        – L.Dutch
                        1 hour ago










                      • Argh, I got it mixed up! Thanks for pointing it out.
                        – A Lambent Eye
                        51 mins ago















                      up vote
                      0
                      down vote













                      I'm not sure how small we're talking, but take a look at chimpanzees.



                      Now if you had a chimpanzee become more intelligent (i.e. more synapses and more oxygen-rich blood flowing to the brain, as well as heat dispersion), for reasons such as gaining an advantage over other species or navigating complex and ever-changing environments, it would be quite imaginable.



                      The main issue I spot is heat dispersion, since the surface area is considerably small when compared to the volume of the head. Some of the heat may be transported through the blood, perhaps leading to large ears (such as in African elephants or desert foxes) or tongues (thing panting dogs) to dissipate the heat.



                      A more exotic solution might be to shape the skull in such a way as to increase the surface area, perhaps with deep wrinkles or folds, though this may come with structural integrity issues, and will not transport the heat in the center to the surface very quickly. It may also impede the room for the organs, perhaps even causing a split brain for a U-shaped skull.



                      Other than that I don't see a problem whatsoever.



                      EDIT: I'm completely wrong as pointed out in the comments, it's the larger the animal the harder it is to manage heat. Pity though, may have been interesting.






                      share|improve this answer










                      New contributor




                      A Lambent Eye is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                      Check out our Code of Conduct.














                      • 1




                        So that's what the wrinkles on Klingon's foreheads are! They're cooling fins for the mighty warrior brain!
                        – Elmy
                        3 hours ago










                      • Actually for small animals the issue is NOT dissipating too much heat. The surface/volume ration goes like 1/r thus it gets higher as r gets smaller.
                        – L.Dutch
                        1 hour ago










                      • Argh, I got it mixed up! Thanks for pointing it out.
                        – A Lambent Eye
                        51 mins ago













                      up vote
                      0
                      down vote










                      up vote
                      0
                      down vote









                      I'm not sure how small we're talking, but take a look at chimpanzees.



                      Now if you had a chimpanzee become more intelligent (i.e. more synapses and more oxygen-rich blood flowing to the brain, as well as heat dispersion), for reasons such as gaining an advantage over other species or navigating complex and ever-changing environments, it would be quite imaginable.



                      The main issue I spot is heat dispersion, since the surface area is considerably small when compared to the volume of the head. Some of the heat may be transported through the blood, perhaps leading to large ears (such as in African elephants or desert foxes) or tongues (thing panting dogs) to dissipate the heat.



                      A more exotic solution might be to shape the skull in such a way as to increase the surface area, perhaps with deep wrinkles or folds, though this may come with structural integrity issues, and will not transport the heat in the center to the surface very quickly. It may also impede the room for the organs, perhaps even causing a split brain for a U-shaped skull.



                      Other than that I don't see a problem whatsoever.



                      EDIT: I'm completely wrong as pointed out in the comments, it's the larger the animal the harder it is to manage heat. Pity though, may have been interesting.






                      share|improve this answer










                      New contributor




                      A Lambent Eye is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                      Check out our Code of Conduct.









                      I'm not sure how small we're talking, but take a look at chimpanzees.



                      Now if you had a chimpanzee become more intelligent (i.e. more synapses and more oxygen-rich blood flowing to the brain, as well as heat dispersion), for reasons such as gaining an advantage over other species or navigating complex and ever-changing environments, it would be quite imaginable.



                      The main issue I spot is heat dispersion, since the surface area is considerably small when compared to the volume of the head. Some of the heat may be transported through the blood, perhaps leading to large ears (such as in African elephants or desert foxes) or tongues (thing panting dogs) to dissipate the heat.



                      A more exotic solution might be to shape the skull in such a way as to increase the surface area, perhaps with deep wrinkles or folds, though this may come with structural integrity issues, and will not transport the heat in the center to the surface very quickly. It may also impede the room for the organs, perhaps even causing a split brain for a U-shaped skull.



                      Other than that I don't see a problem whatsoever.



                      EDIT: I'm completely wrong as pointed out in the comments, it's the larger the animal the harder it is to manage heat. Pity though, may have been interesting.







                      share|improve this answer










                      New contributor




                      A Lambent Eye is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                      Check out our Code of Conduct.









                      share|improve this answer



                      share|improve this answer








                      edited 49 mins ago





















                      New contributor




                      A Lambent Eye is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                      Check out our Code of Conduct.









                      answered 3 hours ago









                      A Lambent Eye

                      1165




                      1165




                      New contributor




                      A Lambent Eye is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                      Check out our Code of Conduct.





                      New contributor





                      A Lambent Eye is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                      Check out our Code of Conduct.






                      A Lambent Eye is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                      Check out our Code of Conduct.








                      • 1




                        So that's what the wrinkles on Klingon's foreheads are! They're cooling fins for the mighty warrior brain!
                        – Elmy
                        3 hours ago










                      • Actually for small animals the issue is NOT dissipating too much heat. The surface/volume ration goes like 1/r thus it gets higher as r gets smaller.
                        – L.Dutch
                        1 hour ago










                      • Argh, I got it mixed up! Thanks for pointing it out.
                        – A Lambent Eye
                        51 mins ago














                      • 1




                        So that's what the wrinkles on Klingon's foreheads are! They're cooling fins for the mighty warrior brain!
                        – Elmy
                        3 hours ago










                      • Actually for small animals the issue is NOT dissipating too much heat. The surface/volume ration goes like 1/r thus it gets higher as r gets smaller.
                        – L.Dutch
                        1 hour ago










                      • Argh, I got it mixed up! Thanks for pointing it out.
                        – A Lambent Eye
                        51 mins ago








                      1




                      1




                      So that's what the wrinkles on Klingon's foreheads are! They're cooling fins for the mighty warrior brain!
                      – Elmy
                      3 hours ago




                      So that's what the wrinkles on Klingon's foreheads are! They're cooling fins for the mighty warrior brain!
                      – Elmy
                      3 hours ago












                      Actually for small animals the issue is NOT dissipating too much heat. The surface/volume ration goes like 1/r thus it gets higher as r gets smaller.
                      – L.Dutch
                      1 hour ago




                      Actually for small animals the issue is NOT dissipating too much heat. The surface/volume ration goes like 1/r thus it gets higher as r gets smaller.
                      – L.Dutch
                      1 hour ago












                      Argh, I got it mixed up! Thanks for pointing it out.
                      – A Lambent Eye
                      51 mins ago




                      Argh, I got it mixed up! Thanks for pointing it out.
                      – A Lambent Eye
                      51 mins ago


















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