When are quotients of homeomorphic spaces homeomorphic?
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Let $X$ and $Y$ be homeomorphic topological spaces, connected by the homeomorphism $f : X rightarrow Y$. Let $sim$ be an equivalence relation on $X$ and $approx$ be an equivalence relation on $Y$.
I would think that there would be some structure that I could place on the equivalence relations $sim$ and $approx$ that would allow me to construct, using the homeomorphism $f$, a homeomorphism $bar{f}$ from $X/sim$ to $Y/approx$. I suspect that that relationship is $a sim b leftrightarrow f(a) approx f(b), forall a, b in X$.
That is, I suspect that "equivalent" quotients of homeomorphic spaces are homeomorphic, but I don't know exactly how to formulate this or prove it.
(This result, by the way, to me, seems to hinge on the existence of a "reverse" universal quotient property: juts as functions $f : X/sim rightarrow Y$ correspond uniquely to a subset of functions $f : X rightarrow Y$, I suspect that functions $f : X rightarrow Y/approx$ correspond uniquely to some subset of functions $f : X rightarrow Y$, but I don't know how this works either.)
general-topology category-theory
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favorite
Let $X$ and $Y$ be homeomorphic topological spaces, connected by the homeomorphism $f : X rightarrow Y$. Let $sim$ be an equivalence relation on $X$ and $approx$ be an equivalence relation on $Y$.
I would think that there would be some structure that I could place on the equivalence relations $sim$ and $approx$ that would allow me to construct, using the homeomorphism $f$, a homeomorphism $bar{f}$ from $X/sim$ to $Y/approx$. I suspect that that relationship is $a sim b leftrightarrow f(a) approx f(b), forall a, b in X$.
That is, I suspect that "equivalent" quotients of homeomorphic spaces are homeomorphic, but I don't know exactly how to formulate this or prove it.
(This result, by the way, to me, seems to hinge on the existence of a "reverse" universal quotient property: juts as functions $f : X/sim rightarrow Y$ correspond uniquely to a subset of functions $f : X rightarrow Y$, I suspect that functions $f : X rightarrow Y/approx$ correspond uniquely to some subset of functions $f : X rightarrow Y$, but I don't know how this works either.)
general-topology category-theory
There is no such "reverse universal property". For instance you have many maps $S^1to S^1$ that don't factor through the quotient map $mathbb{R}to S^1$
– Max
5 hours ago
Hmm, interesting. Is there a familiar subset of maps that do factor through in this fashion? I wonder if the question I'm asking here is best answered topologically or categorically.
– Billy Smith
3 hours ago
In the specific case of $mathbb{R}to S^1$ the maps $Xto S^1$ that factor through it are precisely the nullhomotopic maps if $X$ is connected and locally path-connected. I don't know if there's a criterion for general quotient maps, but I don't think there is.
– Max
3 hours ago
add a comment |
up vote
4
down vote
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up vote
4
down vote
favorite
Let $X$ and $Y$ be homeomorphic topological spaces, connected by the homeomorphism $f : X rightarrow Y$. Let $sim$ be an equivalence relation on $X$ and $approx$ be an equivalence relation on $Y$.
I would think that there would be some structure that I could place on the equivalence relations $sim$ and $approx$ that would allow me to construct, using the homeomorphism $f$, a homeomorphism $bar{f}$ from $X/sim$ to $Y/approx$. I suspect that that relationship is $a sim b leftrightarrow f(a) approx f(b), forall a, b in X$.
That is, I suspect that "equivalent" quotients of homeomorphic spaces are homeomorphic, but I don't know exactly how to formulate this or prove it.
(This result, by the way, to me, seems to hinge on the existence of a "reverse" universal quotient property: juts as functions $f : X/sim rightarrow Y$ correspond uniquely to a subset of functions $f : X rightarrow Y$, I suspect that functions $f : X rightarrow Y/approx$ correspond uniquely to some subset of functions $f : X rightarrow Y$, but I don't know how this works either.)
general-topology category-theory
Let $X$ and $Y$ be homeomorphic topological spaces, connected by the homeomorphism $f : X rightarrow Y$. Let $sim$ be an equivalence relation on $X$ and $approx$ be an equivalence relation on $Y$.
I would think that there would be some structure that I could place on the equivalence relations $sim$ and $approx$ that would allow me to construct, using the homeomorphism $f$, a homeomorphism $bar{f}$ from $X/sim$ to $Y/approx$. I suspect that that relationship is $a sim b leftrightarrow f(a) approx f(b), forall a, b in X$.
That is, I suspect that "equivalent" quotients of homeomorphic spaces are homeomorphic, but I don't know exactly how to formulate this or prove it.
(This result, by the way, to me, seems to hinge on the existence of a "reverse" universal quotient property: juts as functions $f : X/sim rightarrow Y$ correspond uniquely to a subset of functions $f : X rightarrow Y$, I suspect that functions $f : X rightarrow Y/approx$ correspond uniquely to some subset of functions $f : X rightarrow Y$, but I don't know how this works either.)
general-topology category-theory
general-topology category-theory
asked 6 hours ago
Billy Smith
635
635
There is no such "reverse universal property". For instance you have many maps $S^1to S^1$ that don't factor through the quotient map $mathbb{R}to S^1$
– Max
5 hours ago
Hmm, interesting. Is there a familiar subset of maps that do factor through in this fashion? I wonder if the question I'm asking here is best answered topologically or categorically.
– Billy Smith
3 hours ago
In the specific case of $mathbb{R}to S^1$ the maps $Xto S^1$ that factor through it are precisely the nullhomotopic maps if $X$ is connected and locally path-connected. I don't know if there's a criterion for general quotient maps, but I don't think there is.
– Max
3 hours ago
add a comment |
There is no such "reverse universal property". For instance you have many maps $S^1to S^1$ that don't factor through the quotient map $mathbb{R}to S^1$
– Max
5 hours ago
Hmm, interesting. Is there a familiar subset of maps that do factor through in this fashion? I wonder if the question I'm asking here is best answered topologically or categorically.
– Billy Smith
3 hours ago
In the specific case of $mathbb{R}to S^1$ the maps $Xto S^1$ that factor through it are precisely the nullhomotopic maps if $X$ is connected and locally path-connected. I don't know if there's a criterion for general quotient maps, but I don't think there is.
– Max
3 hours ago
There is no such "reverse universal property". For instance you have many maps $S^1to S^1$ that don't factor through the quotient map $mathbb{R}to S^1$
– Max
5 hours ago
There is no such "reverse universal property". For instance you have many maps $S^1to S^1$ that don't factor through the quotient map $mathbb{R}to S^1$
– Max
5 hours ago
Hmm, interesting. Is there a familiar subset of maps that do factor through in this fashion? I wonder if the question I'm asking here is best answered topologically or categorically.
– Billy Smith
3 hours ago
Hmm, interesting. Is there a familiar subset of maps that do factor through in this fashion? I wonder if the question I'm asking here is best answered topologically or categorically.
– Billy Smith
3 hours ago
In the specific case of $mathbb{R}to S^1$ the maps $Xto S^1$ that factor through it are precisely the nullhomotopic maps if $X$ is connected and locally path-connected. I don't know if there's a criterion for general quotient maps, but I don't think there is.
– Max
3 hours ago
In the specific case of $mathbb{R}to S^1$ the maps $Xto S^1$ that factor through it are precisely the nullhomotopic maps if $X$ is connected and locally path-connected. I don't know if there's a criterion for general quotient maps, but I don't think there is.
– Max
3 hours ago
add a comment |
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Your suspicion is correct. If $X$ and $Y$ are topological spaces with equivalence relations $sim$ and $approx$ and $f:Xto Y$ is a homeomorphism such that $xsim y$ if and only if $f(x)approx f(y)$, then $f$ passes to the quotient as $X/_sim cong Y/_approx$.
Proof goes roughly like this: define $widetilde{f}([x]_sim)doteq [f(x)]_approx$. We have that $widetilde{f}$ is well-defined and injective because of the condition relating $sim$ and $approx$, while surjectivity follows from the surjectivity of $f$. Continuity of $widetilde{f}$ and $widetilde{f}^{-1}$ follow from the universal property of the quotient topologies applied to the relations $widetilde{f}circpi_{sim}=pi_{approx}circ f$ and $widetilde{f}^{-1}circ pi_{approx}=pi_simcirc f^{-1}$ with the continuity of $f$ and $f^{-1}$.
add a comment |
up vote
3
down vote
I think you are correct. Here is a sketch of the argument:
$phi:=pi_Ycirc f$ is a continuous surjection: $Xto Y/approx$ and it induces a bijection: $X^*=left { phi^{-1}([y]): [y]in Y/approx right }overset{overlinephi}{rightarrow} Y/approx , $ which is a homeomorphism if and only if $phi$ is a quotient map.
As $phi $ is indeed a quotient map, the induced map is a homeomorphism. So, $X/sim$ and $Y/approx$ will be homoeomorphic if and only if $X^*$ and $X/sim$ are.
This means that the map $[x]mapsto f^{-1}circ pi^{-1}_Y([y])$ must be a homeomorphism. That is, $f([x])mapsto pi^{-1}_Y([y])$ must be a homeomorphism.
But the above map is well-defined if and only if $xsim x'Rightarrow f(x)approx f(x'),$ and in this case, it is obviously continuous, and it should be easy to check that it is bijective with continuous inverse.
add a comment |
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2 Answers
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2 Answers
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up vote
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Your suspicion is correct. If $X$ and $Y$ are topological spaces with equivalence relations $sim$ and $approx$ and $f:Xto Y$ is a homeomorphism such that $xsim y$ if and only if $f(x)approx f(y)$, then $f$ passes to the quotient as $X/_sim cong Y/_approx$.
Proof goes roughly like this: define $widetilde{f}([x]_sim)doteq [f(x)]_approx$. We have that $widetilde{f}$ is well-defined and injective because of the condition relating $sim$ and $approx$, while surjectivity follows from the surjectivity of $f$. Continuity of $widetilde{f}$ and $widetilde{f}^{-1}$ follow from the universal property of the quotient topologies applied to the relations $widetilde{f}circpi_{sim}=pi_{approx}circ f$ and $widetilde{f}^{-1}circ pi_{approx}=pi_simcirc f^{-1}$ with the continuity of $f$ and $f^{-1}$.
add a comment |
up vote
4
down vote
Your suspicion is correct. If $X$ and $Y$ are topological spaces with equivalence relations $sim$ and $approx$ and $f:Xto Y$ is a homeomorphism such that $xsim y$ if and only if $f(x)approx f(y)$, then $f$ passes to the quotient as $X/_sim cong Y/_approx$.
Proof goes roughly like this: define $widetilde{f}([x]_sim)doteq [f(x)]_approx$. We have that $widetilde{f}$ is well-defined and injective because of the condition relating $sim$ and $approx$, while surjectivity follows from the surjectivity of $f$. Continuity of $widetilde{f}$ and $widetilde{f}^{-1}$ follow from the universal property of the quotient topologies applied to the relations $widetilde{f}circpi_{sim}=pi_{approx}circ f$ and $widetilde{f}^{-1}circ pi_{approx}=pi_simcirc f^{-1}$ with the continuity of $f$ and $f^{-1}$.
add a comment |
up vote
4
down vote
up vote
4
down vote
Your suspicion is correct. If $X$ and $Y$ are topological spaces with equivalence relations $sim$ and $approx$ and $f:Xto Y$ is a homeomorphism such that $xsim y$ if and only if $f(x)approx f(y)$, then $f$ passes to the quotient as $X/_sim cong Y/_approx$.
Proof goes roughly like this: define $widetilde{f}([x]_sim)doteq [f(x)]_approx$. We have that $widetilde{f}$ is well-defined and injective because of the condition relating $sim$ and $approx$, while surjectivity follows from the surjectivity of $f$. Continuity of $widetilde{f}$ and $widetilde{f}^{-1}$ follow from the universal property of the quotient topologies applied to the relations $widetilde{f}circpi_{sim}=pi_{approx}circ f$ and $widetilde{f}^{-1}circ pi_{approx}=pi_simcirc f^{-1}$ with the continuity of $f$ and $f^{-1}$.
Your suspicion is correct. If $X$ and $Y$ are topological spaces with equivalence relations $sim$ and $approx$ and $f:Xto Y$ is a homeomorphism such that $xsim y$ if and only if $f(x)approx f(y)$, then $f$ passes to the quotient as $X/_sim cong Y/_approx$.
Proof goes roughly like this: define $widetilde{f}([x]_sim)doteq [f(x)]_approx$. We have that $widetilde{f}$ is well-defined and injective because of the condition relating $sim$ and $approx$, while surjectivity follows from the surjectivity of $f$. Continuity of $widetilde{f}$ and $widetilde{f}^{-1}$ follow from the universal property of the quotient topologies applied to the relations $widetilde{f}circpi_{sim}=pi_{approx}circ f$ and $widetilde{f}^{-1}circ pi_{approx}=pi_simcirc f^{-1}$ with the continuity of $f$ and $f^{-1}$.
answered 5 hours ago
Ivo Terek
45.2k951139
45.2k951139
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add a comment |
up vote
3
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I think you are correct. Here is a sketch of the argument:
$phi:=pi_Ycirc f$ is a continuous surjection: $Xto Y/approx$ and it induces a bijection: $X^*=left { phi^{-1}([y]): [y]in Y/approx right }overset{overlinephi}{rightarrow} Y/approx , $ which is a homeomorphism if and only if $phi$ is a quotient map.
As $phi $ is indeed a quotient map, the induced map is a homeomorphism. So, $X/sim$ and $Y/approx$ will be homoeomorphic if and only if $X^*$ and $X/sim$ are.
This means that the map $[x]mapsto f^{-1}circ pi^{-1}_Y([y])$ must be a homeomorphism. That is, $f([x])mapsto pi^{-1}_Y([y])$ must be a homeomorphism.
But the above map is well-defined if and only if $xsim x'Rightarrow f(x)approx f(x'),$ and in this case, it is obviously continuous, and it should be easy to check that it is bijective with continuous inverse.
add a comment |
up vote
3
down vote
I think you are correct. Here is a sketch of the argument:
$phi:=pi_Ycirc f$ is a continuous surjection: $Xto Y/approx$ and it induces a bijection: $X^*=left { phi^{-1}([y]): [y]in Y/approx right }overset{overlinephi}{rightarrow} Y/approx , $ which is a homeomorphism if and only if $phi$ is a quotient map.
As $phi $ is indeed a quotient map, the induced map is a homeomorphism. So, $X/sim$ and $Y/approx$ will be homoeomorphic if and only if $X^*$ and $X/sim$ are.
This means that the map $[x]mapsto f^{-1}circ pi^{-1}_Y([y])$ must be a homeomorphism. That is, $f([x])mapsto pi^{-1}_Y([y])$ must be a homeomorphism.
But the above map is well-defined if and only if $xsim x'Rightarrow f(x)approx f(x'),$ and in this case, it is obviously continuous, and it should be easy to check that it is bijective with continuous inverse.
add a comment |
up vote
3
down vote
up vote
3
down vote
I think you are correct. Here is a sketch of the argument:
$phi:=pi_Ycirc f$ is a continuous surjection: $Xto Y/approx$ and it induces a bijection: $X^*=left { phi^{-1}([y]): [y]in Y/approx right }overset{overlinephi}{rightarrow} Y/approx , $ which is a homeomorphism if and only if $phi$ is a quotient map.
As $phi $ is indeed a quotient map, the induced map is a homeomorphism. So, $X/sim$ and $Y/approx$ will be homoeomorphic if and only if $X^*$ and $X/sim$ are.
This means that the map $[x]mapsto f^{-1}circ pi^{-1}_Y([y])$ must be a homeomorphism. That is, $f([x])mapsto pi^{-1}_Y([y])$ must be a homeomorphism.
But the above map is well-defined if and only if $xsim x'Rightarrow f(x)approx f(x'),$ and in this case, it is obviously continuous, and it should be easy to check that it is bijective with continuous inverse.
I think you are correct. Here is a sketch of the argument:
$phi:=pi_Ycirc f$ is a continuous surjection: $Xto Y/approx$ and it induces a bijection: $X^*=left { phi^{-1}([y]): [y]in Y/approx right }overset{overlinephi}{rightarrow} Y/approx , $ which is a homeomorphism if and only if $phi$ is a quotient map.
As $phi $ is indeed a quotient map, the induced map is a homeomorphism. So, $X/sim$ and $Y/approx$ will be homoeomorphic if and only if $X^*$ and $X/sim$ are.
This means that the map $[x]mapsto f^{-1}circ pi^{-1}_Y([y])$ must be a homeomorphism. That is, $f([x])mapsto pi^{-1}_Y([y])$ must be a homeomorphism.
But the above map is well-defined if and only if $xsim x'Rightarrow f(x)approx f(x'),$ and in this case, it is obviously continuous, and it should be easy to check that it is bijective with continuous inverse.
edited 3 hours ago
answered 4 hours ago
Matematleta
9,7772918
9,7772918
add a comment |
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There is no such "reverse universal property". For instance you have many maps $S^1to S^1$ that don't factor through the quotient map $mathbb{R}to S^1$
– Max
5 hours ago
Hmm, interesting. Is there a familiar subset of maps that do factor through in this fashion? I wonder if the question I'm asking here is best answered topologically or categorically.
– Billy Smith
3 hours ago
In the specific case of $mathbb{R}to S^1$ the maps $Xto S^1$ that factor through it are precisely the nullhomotopic maps if $X$ is connected and locally path-connected. I don't know if there's a criterion for general quotient maps, but I don't think there is.
– Max
3 hours ago