Can't we factor out a constant in the cross product?
$begingroup$
I have the vectors $A=ahat e_x$ and $B=ahat e_y$, so
$$
Atimes B =
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
a & 0 & 0\
0 & a &0
end{vmatrix}=hat za^2
$$
Q1: But why is the following wrong
begin{align}
Atimes B &=ahat e_xtimes ahat e_y\
&=(ahat e_x)times (ahat e_y) tag 1\
&=(ahat e_x)times (hat e_ya) tag 2\
&=a(hat e_x)times (hat e_y)a tag 3\
&=a((hat e_x)times (hat e_y)) tag 4\
&=a(hat e_xtimes hat e_y) tag 5\
&=ahat e_z quad ?
end{align}
Q2: Also, why is this wrong
begin{align}
Atimes B &=
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
a & 0 & 0\
0 & a &0
end{vmatrix} \
&=
a
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\ tag 6
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}\
&=ahat z quad ?
end{align}
linear-algebra vectors cross-product
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
I have the vectors $A=ahat e_x$ and $B=ahat e_y$, so
$$
Atimes B =
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
a & 0 & 0\
0 & a &0
end{vmatrix}=hat za^2
$$
Q1: But why is the following wrong
begin{align}
Atimes B &=ahat e_xtimes ahat e_y\
&=(ahat e_x)times (ahat e_y) tag 1\
&=(ahat e_x)times (hat e_ya) tag 2\
&=a(hat e_x)times (hat e_y)a tag 3\
&=a((hat e_x)times (hat e_y)) tag 4\
&=a(hat e_xtimes hat e_y) tag 5\
&=ahat e_z quad ?
end{align}
Q2: Also, why is this wrong
begin{align}
Atimes B &=
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
a & 0 & 0\
0 & a &0
end{vmatrix} \
&=
a
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\ tag 6
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}\
&=ahat z quad ?
end{align}
linear-algebra vectors cross-product
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
They are wrong because the cross-product isn't defined that way.
$endgroup$
– Bernard Massé
Dec 4 '18 at 11:00
1
$begingroup$
You can take out a common factor of a single row in a determinant. Here you take out the common factor from two rows. That's two factors, each equal to $a$. Therefore you get $a^2$ altogether.
$endgroup$
– Jyrki Lahtonen
Dec 4 '18 at 11:06
$begingroup$
@Bernard Massé Why do you say that ? it is a form that is used rather usually in physics. Have a look at physics.stackexchange.com/q/133311
$endgroup$
– Jean Marie
Dec 4 '18 at 18:11
$begingroup$
@ Jean Marie. What I meant was the cross-product is defined in such a way (be it done by determinants or another way) that product by a constant is not distributive over it.
$endgroup$
– Bernard Massé
Dec 5 '18 at 16:20
add a comment |
$begingroup$
I have the vectors $A=ahat e_x$ and $B=ahat e_y$, so
$$
Atimes B =
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
a & 0 & 0\
0 & a &0
end{vmatrix}=hat za^2
$$
Q1: But why is the following wrong
begin{align}
Atimes B &=ahat e_xtimes ahat e_y\
&=(ahat e_x)times (ahat e_y) tag 1\
&=(ahat e_x)times (hat e_ya) tag 2\
&=a(hat e_x)times (hat e_y)a tag 3\
&=a((hat e_x)times (hat e_y)) tag 4\
&=a(hat e_xtimes hat e_y) tag 5\
&=ahat e_z quad ?
end{align}
Q2: Also, why is this wrong
begin{align}
Atimes B &=
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
a & 0 & 0\
0 & a &0
end{vmatrix} \
&=
a
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\ tag 6
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}\
&=ahat z quad ?
end{align}
linear-algebra vectors cross-product
$endgroup$
I have the vectors $A=ahat e_x$ and $B=ahat e_y$, so
$$
Atimes B =
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
a & 0 & 0\
0 & a &0
end{vmatrix}=hat za^2
$$
Q1: But why is the following wrong
begin{align}
Atimes B &=ahat e_xtimes ahat e_y\
&=(ahat e_x)times (ahat e_y) tag 1\
&=(ahat e_x)times (hat e_ya) tag 2\
&=a(hat e_x)times (hat e_y)a tag 3\
&=a((hat e_x)times (hat e_y)) tag 4\
&=a(hat e_xtimes hat e_y) tag 5\
&=ahat e_z quad ?
end{align}
Q2: Also, why is this wrong
begin{align}
Atimes B &=
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
a & 0 & 0\
0 & a &0
end{vmatrix} \
&=
a
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\ tag 6
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}\
&=ahat z quad ?
end{align}
linear-algebra vectors cross-product
linear-algebra vectors cross-product
asked Dec 4 '18 at 10:57
DonsertDonsert
1339
1339
$begingroup$
They are wrong because the cross-product isn't defined that way.
$endgroup$
– Bernard Massé
Dec 4 '18 at 11:00
1
$begingroup$
You can take out a common factor of a single row in a determinant. Here you take out the common factor from two rows. That's two factors, each equal to $a$. Therefore you get $a^2$ altogether.
$endgroup$
– Jyrki Lahtonen
Dec 4 '18 at 11:06
$begingroup$
@Bernard Massé Why do you say that ? it is a form that is used rather usually in physics. Have a look at physics.stackexchange.com/q/133311
$endgroup$
– Jean Marie
Dec 4 '18 at 18:11
$begingroup$
@ Jean Marie. What I meant was the cross-product is defined in such a way (be it done by determinants or another way) that product by a constant is not distributive over it.
$endgroup$
– Bernard Massé
Dec 5 '18 at 16:20
add a comment |
$begingroup$
They are wrong because the cross-product isn't defined that way.
$endgroup$
– Bernard Massé
Dec 4 '18 at 11:00
1
$begingroup$
You can take out a common factor of a single row in a determinant. Here you take out the common factor from two rows. That's two factors, each equal to $a$. Therefore you get $a^2$ altogether.
$endgroup$
– Jyrki Lahtonen
Dec 4 '18 at 11:06
$begingroup$
@Bernard Massé Why do you say that ? it is a form that is used rather usually in physics. Have a look at physics.stackexchange.com/q/133311
$endgroup$
– Jean Marie
Dec 4 '18 at 18:11
$begingroup$
@ Jean Marie. What I meant was the cross-product is defined in such a way (be it done by determinants or another way) that product by a constant is not distributive over it.
$endgroup$
– Bernard Massé
Dec 5 '18 at 16:20
$begingroup$
They are wrong because the cross-product isn't defined that way.
$endgroup$
– Bernard Massé
Dec 4 '18 at 11:00
$begingroup$
They are wrong because the cross-product isn't defined that way.
$endgroup$
– Bernard Massé
Dec 4 '18 at 11:00
1
1
$begingroup$
You can take out a common factor of a single row in a determinant. Here you take out the common factor from two rows. That's two factors, each equal to $a$. Therefore you get $a^2$ altogether.
$endgroup$
– Jyrki Lahtonen
Dec 4 '18 at 11:06
$begingroup$
You can take out a common factor of a single row in a determinant. Here you take out the common factor from two rows. That's two factors, each equal to $a$. Therefore you get $a^2$ altogether.
$endgroup$
– Jyrki Lahtonen
Dec 4 '18 at 11:06
$begingroup$
@Bernard Massé Why do you say that ? it is a form that is used rather usually in physics. Have a look at physics.stackexchange.com/q/133311
$endgroup$
– Jean Marie
Dec 4 '18 at 18:11
$begingroup$
@Bernard Massé Why do you say that ? it is a form that is used rather usually in physics. Have a look at physics.stackexchange.com/q/133311
$endgroup$
– Jean Marie
Dec 4 '18 at 18:11
$begingroup$
@ Jean Marie. What I meant was the cross-product is defined in such a way (be it done by determinants or another way) that product by a constant is not distributive over it.
$endgroup$
– Bernard Massé
Dec 5 '18 at 16:20
$begingroup$
@ Jean Marie. What I meant was the cross-product is defined in such a way (be it done by determinants or another way) that product by a constant is not distributive over it.
$endgroup$
– Bernard Massé
Dec 5 '18 at 16:20
add a comment |
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
$$=a(hat e_x)times (hat e_y)a tag 3$$
$$=a((hat e_x)times (hat e_y)) tag 4$$
What happens here...?
You may be mixing it up with the distributive property of the cross product over addition.
Q2: Also, why is this wrong
begin{align}
Atimes B &=
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
a & 0 & 0\
0 & a &0
end{vmatrix} \
&=
a
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\ tag 6
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}\
&=ahat z quad ?
end{align}
For starters, the determinant notation for computing the cross product is actually just a mnemonic. But if you want to use properties of determinants, you should note that the determinant is linear in its columns and rows, so for example:
$$begin{vmatrix}
a & b & c \
color{purple}{k}d& color{purple}{k}e & color{purple}{k}f \
g & h & i
end{vmatrix}=color{purple}{k}begin{vmatrix}
a & b & c \
d& e & f \
g & h & i
end{vmatrix}$$
This means that if you want to factor out the $a$, you do that for the second and the third row:
$$begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
color{blue}{a}& 0 & 0\
0 & color{red}{a} &0
end{vmatrix}=color{blue}{a}color{red}{a}begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}=a^2begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}$$
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
We have that by cross product definition
$$Atimes B =ahat e_xtimes ahat e_y=a^2( e_xtimes hat e_y)$$
and by the properties of the determinant
$$Atimes B =
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
a & 0 & 0\
0 & a &0
end{vmatrix} =
a^2
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\ tag 6
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}$$
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Your first argument is wrong because you lost an $a$ between lines (3) and (4).
Your second argument is wrong because line (6) should have $a^2$, not $a$. You can confirm this just by evaluating the determinant, as you did at the beginning of your post. You have somehow misunderstood the rules for removing common factors from determinants.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
Your Answer
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3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
$$=a(hat e_x)times (hat e_y)a tag 3$$
$$=a((hat e_x)times (hat e_y)) tag 4$$
What happens here...?
You may be mixing it up with the distributive property of the cross product over addition.
Q2: Also, why is this wrong
begin{align}
Atimes B &=
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
a & 0 & 0\
0 & a &0
end{vmatrix} \
&=
a
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\ tag 6
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}\
&=ahat z quad ?
end{align}
For starters, the determinant notation for computing the cross product is actually just a mnemonic. But if you want to use properties of determinants, you should note that the determinant is linear in its columns and rows, so for example:
$$begin{vmatrix}
a & b & c \
color{purple}{k}d& color{purple}{k}e & color{purple}{k}f \
g & h & i
end{vmatrix}=color{purple}{k}begin{vmatrix}
a & b & c \
d& e & f \
g & h & i
end{vmatrix}$$
This means that if you want to factor out the $a$, you do that for the second and the third row:
$$begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
color{blue}{a}& 0 & 0\
0 & color{red}{a} &0
end{vmatrix}=color{blue}{a}color{red}{a}begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}=a^2begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}$$
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
$$=a(hat e_x)times (hat e_y)a tag 3$$
$$=a((hat e_x)times (hat e_y)) tag 4$$
What happens here...?
You may be mixing it up with the distributive property of the cross product over addition.
Q2: Also, why is this wrong
begin{align}
Atimes B &=
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
a & 0 & 0\
0 & a &0
end{vmatrix} \
&=
a
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\ tag 6
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}\
&=ahat z quad ?
end{align}
For starters, the determinant notation for computing the cross product is actually just a mnemonic. But if you want to use properties of determinants, you should note that the determinant is linear in its columns and rows, so for example:
$$begin{vmatrix}
a & b & c \
color{purple}{k}d& color{purple}{k}e & color{purple}{k}f \
g & h & i
end{vmatrix}=color{purple}{k}begin{vmatrix}
a & b & c \
d& e & f \
g & h & i
end{vmatrix}$$
This means that if you want to factor out the $a$, you do that for the second and the third row:
$$begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
color{blue}{a}& 0 & 0\
0 & color{red}{a} &0
end{vmatrix}=color{blue}{a}color{red}{a}begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}=a^2begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}$$
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
$$=a(hat e_x)times (hat e_y)a tag 3$$
$$=a((hat e_x)times (hat e_y)) tag 4$$
What happens here...?
You may be mixing it up with the distributive property of the cross product over addition.
Q2: Also, why is this wrong
begin{align}
Atimes B &=
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
a & 0 & 0\
0 & a &0
end{vmatrix} \
&=
a
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\ tag 6
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}\
&=ahat z quad ?
end{align}
For starters, the determinant notation for computing the cross product is actually just a mnemonic. But if you want to use properties of determinants, you should note that the determinant is linear in its columns and rows, so for example:
$$begin{vmatrix}
a & b & c \
color{purple}{k}d& color{purple}{k}e & color{purple}{k}f \
g & h & i
end{vmatrix}=color{purple}{k}begin{vmatrix}
a & b & c \
d& e & f \
g & h & i
end{vmatrix}$$
This means that if you want to factor out the $a$, you do that for the second and the third row:
$$begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
color{blue}{a}& 0 & 0\
0 & color{red}{a} &0
end{vmatrix}=color{blue}{a}color{red}{a}begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}=a^2begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}$$
$endgroup$
$$=a(hat e_x)times (hat e_y)a tag 3$$
$$=a((hat e_x)times (hat e_y)) tag 4$$
What happens here...?
You may be mixing it up with the distributive property of the cross product over addition.
Q2: Also, why is this wrong
begin{align}
Atimes B &=
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
a & 0 & 0\
0 & a &0
end{vmatrix} \
&=
a
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\ tag 6
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}\
&=ahat z quad ?
end{align}
For starters, the determinant notation for computing the cross product is actually just a mnemonic. But if you want to use properties of determinants, you should note that the determinant is linear in its columns and rows, so for example:
$$begin{vmatrix}
a & b & c \
color{purple}{k}d& color{purple}{k}e & color{purple}{k}f \
g & h & i
end{vmatrix}=color{purple}{k}begin{vmatrix}
a & b & c \
d& e & f \
g & h & i
end{vmatrix}$$
This means that if you want to factor out the $a$, you do that for the second and the third row:
$$begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
color{blue}{a}& 0 & 0\
0 & color{red}{a} &0
end{vmatrix}=color{blue}{a}color{red}{a}begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}=a^2begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}$$
answered Dec 4 '18 at 11:05
StackTDStackTD
22.6k2049
22.6k2049
add a comment |
add a comment |
$begingroup$
We have that by cross product definition
$$Atimes B =ahat e_xtimes ahat e_y=a^2( e_xtimes hat e_y)$$
and by the properties of the determinant
$$Atimes B =
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
a & 0 & 0\
0 & a &0
end{vmatrix} =
a^2
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\ tag 6
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}$$
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
We have that by cross product definition
$$Atimes B =ahat e_xtimes ahat e_y=a^2( e_xtimes hat e_y)$$
and by the properties of the determinant
$$Atimes B =
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
a & 0 & 0\
0 & a &0
end{vmatrix} =
a^2
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\ tag 6
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}$$
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
We have that by cross product definition
$$Atimes B =ahat e_xtimes ahat e_y=a^2( e_xtimes hat e_y)$$
and by the properties of the determinant
$$Atimes B =
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
a & 0 & 0\
0 & a &0
end{vmatrix} =
a^2
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\ tag 6
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}$$
$endgroup$
We have that by cross product definition
$$Atimes B =ahat e_xtimes ahat e_y=a^2( e_xtimes hat e_y)$$
and by the properties of the determinant
$$Atimes B =
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
a & 0 & 0\
0 & a &0
end{vmatrix} =
a^2
begin{vmatrix}
hat e_x &hat e_y & hat e_z \
1 & 0 & 0\ tag 6
0 & 1 &0
end{vmatrix}$$
answered Dec 4 '18 at 11:00
gimusigimusi
92.9k94494
92.9k94494
add a comment |
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Your first argument is wrong because you lost an $a$ between lines (3) and (4).
Your second argument is wrong because line (6) should have $a^2$, not $a$. You can confirm this just by evaluating the determinant, as you did at the beginning of your post. You have somehow misunderstood the rules for removing common factors from determinants.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Your first argument is wrong because you lost an $a$ between lines (3) and (4).
Your second argument is wrong because line (6) should have $a^2$, not $a$. You can confirm this just by evaluating the determinant, as you did at the beginning of your post. You have somehow misunderstood the rules for removing common factors from determinants.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Your first argument is wrong because you lost an $a$ between lines (3) and (4).
Your second argument is wrong because line (6) should have $a^2$, not $a$. You can confirm this just by evaluating the determinant, as you did at the beginning of your post. You have somehow misunderstood the rules for removing common factors from determinants.
$endgroup$
Your first argument is wrong because you lost an $a$ between lines (3) and (4).
Your second argument is wrong because line (6) should have $a^2$, not $a$. You can confirm this just by evaluating the determinant, as you did at the beginning of your post. You have somehow misunderstood the rules for removing common factors from determinants.
answered Dec 4 '18 at 11:02
bubbabubba
30.3k33086
30.3k33086
add a comment |
add a comment |
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$begingroup$
They are wrong because the cross-product isn't defined that way.
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– Bernard Massé
Dec 4 '18 at 11:00
1
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You can take out a common factor of a single row in a determinant. Here you take out the common factor from two rows. That's two factors, each equal to $a$. Therefore you get $a^2$ altogether.
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– Jyrki Lahtonen
Dec 4 '18 at 11:06
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@Bernard Massé Why do you say that ? it is a form that is used rather usually in physics. Have a look at physics.stackexchange.com/q/133311
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– Jean Marie
Dec 4 '18 at 18:11
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@ Jean Marie. What I meant was the cross-product is defined in such a way (be it done by determinants or another way) that product by a constant is not distributive over it.
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– Bernard Massé
Dec 5 '18 at 16:20