If the closed unit ball of Banach space has at least one extreme point, must the Banach space the be a dual...











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Let $X$ be a Banach space.
By Banach-Alaoglu and Krein-Milman Theorems, one can show that if $X$ is a dual space, then $X$ must have at least one extreme point of the closed unit ball.



I am interested in its converse.
More precisely,




Question: Let $X$ be a Banach space.
If the closed unit ball of $X$ has at least one extreme point, must $X$ be a dual space?




I feel that the statement above is negative.
However, I could not produce a counterexample.



In fact, the only Banach spaces which I know that are not dual spaces are $c_0$ and $C_0(mathbb{R})$ (the latter set is the collection of all real-valued continuous function vanishing at infinity) because both sets have no extreme point.










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  • 3




    When you say that "$X$ has at least one extreme point" do you mean that the closed unit ball of $X$ has at least on extreme point?
    – Martin Sleziak
    yesterday










  • I have added the tag (extreme-points), since it seems to me a good fit to the question. There exists also (krein-milman-theorem) tag, but that one would probably be a stretch.
    – Martin Sleziak
    yesterday






  • 4




    This post on Mathematics site seems to be about the same question: Krein-Milman and dual spaces.
    – Martin Sleziak
    yesterday










  • @MartinSleziak Yes, I mean the closed unit ball of $X.$
    – Idonknow
    yesterday






  • 1




    @TarasBanakh: There are infinite compact $K$ for which $C(K)$ is a dual space: these are precisely the hyperstonean $K$, e.g., $betamathbb{N}$. (On the other hand there are non-dual $C(K)$ for which the unit ball is the norm-closed convex hull of its extreme points, e.g. $alphamathbb{N}$. These are precisely the totally disconected $K$.)
    – Dirk Werner
    yesterday















up vote
3
down vote

favorite
1












Let $X$ be a Banach space.
By Banach-Alaoglu and Krein-Milman Theorems, one can show that if $X$ is a dual space, then $X$ must have at least one extreme point of the closed unit ball.



I am interested in its converse.
More precisely,




Question: Let $X$ be a Banach space.
If the closed unit ball of $X$ has at least one extreme point, must $X$ be a dual space?




I feel that the statement above is negative.
However, I could not produce a counterexample.



In fact, the only Banach spaces which I know that are not dual spaces are $c_0$ and $C_0(mathbb{R})$ (the latter set is the collection of all real-valued continuous function vanishing at infinity) because both sets have no extreme point.










share|cite|improve this question




















  • 3




    When you say that "$X$ has at least one extreme point" do you mean that the closed unit ball of $X$ has at least on extreme point?
    – Martin Sleziak
    yesterday










  • I have added the tag (extreme-points), since it seems to me a good fit to the question. There exists also (krein-milman-theorem) tag, but that one would probably be a stretch.
    – Martin Sleziak
    yesterday






  • 4




    This post on Mathematics site seems to be about the same question: Krein-Milman and dual spaces.
    – Martin Sleziak
    yesterday










  • @MartinSleziak Yes, I mean the closed unit ball of $X.$
    – Idonknow
    yesterday






  • 1




    @TarasBanakh: There are infinite compact $K$ for which $C(K)$ is a dual space: these are precisely the hyperstonean $K$, e.g., $betamathbb{N}$. (On the other hand there are non-dual $C(K)$ for which the unit ball is the norm-closed convex hull of its extreme points, e.g. $alphamathbb{N}$. These are precisely the totally disconected $K$.)
    – Dirk Werner
    yesterday













up vote
3
down vote

favorite
1









up vote
3
down vote

favorite
1






1





Let $X$ be a Banach space.
By Banach-Alaoglu and Krein-Milman Theorems, one can show that if $X$ is a dual space, then $X$ must have at least one extreme point of the closed unit ball.



I am interested in its converse.
More precisely,




Question: Let $X$ be a Banach space.
If the closed unit ball of $X$ has at least one extreme point, must $X$ be a dual space?




I feel that the statement above is negative.
However, I could not produce a counterexample.



In fact, the only Banach spaces which I know that are not dual spaces are $c_0$ and $C_0(mathbb{R})$ (the latter set is the collection of all real-valued continuous function vanishing at infinity) because both sets have no extreme point.










share|cite|improve this question















Let $X$ be a Banach space.
By Banach-Alaoglu and Krein-Milman Theorems, one can show that if $X$ is a dual space, then $X$ must have at least one extreme point of the closed unit ball.



I am interested in its converse.
More precisely,




Question: Let $X$ be a Banach space.
If the closed unit ball of $X$ has at least one extreme point, must $X$ be a dual space?




I feel that the statement above is negative.
However, I could not produce a counterexample.



In fact, the only Banach spaces which I know that are not dual spaces are $c_0$ and $C_0(mathbb{R})$ (the latter set is the collection of all real-valued continuous function vanishing at infinity) because both sets have no extreme point.







fa.functional-analysis banach-spaces convexity duality extreme-points






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share|cite|improve this question













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share|cite|improve this question








edited yesterday

























asked yesterday









Idonknow

204312




204312








  • 3




    When you say that "$X$ has at least one extreme point" do you mean that the closed unit ball of $X$ has at least on extreme point?
    – Martin Sleziak
    yesterday










  • I have added the tag (extreme-points), since it seems to me a good fit to the question. There exists also (krein-milman-theorem) tag, but that one would probably be a stretch.
    – Martin Sleziak
    yesterday






  • 4




    This post on Mathematics site seems to be about the same question: Krein-Milman and dual spaces.
    – Martin Sleziak
    yesterday










  • @MartinSleziak Yes, I mean the closed unit ball of $X.$
    – Idonknow
    yesterday






  • 1




    @TarasBanakh: There are infinite compact $K$ for which $C(K)$ is a dual space: these are precisely the hyperstonean $K$, e.g., $betamathbb{N}$. (On the other hand there are non-dual $C(K)$ for which the unit ball is the norm-closed convex hull of its extreme points, e.g. $alphamathbb{N}$. These are precisely the totally disconected $K$.)
    – Dirk Werner
    yesterday














  • 3




    When you say that "$X$ has at least one extreme point" do you mean that the closed unit ball of $X$ has at least on extreme point?
    – Martin Sleziak
    yesterday










  • I have added the tag (extreme-points), since it seems to me a good fit to the question. There exists also (krein-milman-theorem) tag, but that one would probably be a stretch.
    – Martin Sleziak
    yesterday






  • 4




    This post on Mathematics site seems to be about the same question: Krein-Milman and dual spaces.
    – Martin Sleziak
    yesterday










  • @MartinSleziak Yes, I mean the closed unit ball of $X.$
    – Idonknow
    yesterday






  • 1




    @TarasBanakh: There are infinite compact $K$ for which $C(K)$ is a dual space: these are precisely the hyperstonean $K$, e.g., $betamathbb{N}$. (On the other hand there are non-dual $C(K)$ for which the unit ball is the norm-closed convex hull of its extreme points, e.g. $alphamathbb{N}$. These are precisely the totally disconected $K$.)
    – Dirk Werner
    yesterday








3




3




When you say that "$X$ has at least one extreme point" do you mean that the closed unit ball of $X$ has at least on extreme point?
– Martin Sleziak
yesterday




When you say that "$X$ has at least one extreme point" do you mean that the closed unit ball of $X$ has at least on extreme point?
– Martin Sleziak
yesterday












I have added the tag (extreme-points), since it seems to me a good fit to the question. There exists also (krein-milman-theorem) tag, but that one would probably be a stretch.
– Martin Sleziak
yesterday




I have added the tag (extreme-points), since it seems to me a good fit to the question. There exists also (krein-milman-theorem) tag, but that one would probably be a stretch.
– Martin Sleziak
yesterday




4




4




This post on Mathematics site seems to be about the same question: Krein-Milman and dual spaces.
– Martin Sleziak
yesterday




This post on Mathematics site seems to be about the same question: Krein-Milman and dual spaces.
– Martin Sleziak
yesterday












@MartinSleziak Yes, I mean the closed unit ball of $X.$
– Idonknow
yesterday




@MartinSleziak Yes, I mean the closed unit ball of $X.$
– Idonknow
yesterday




1




1




@TarasBanakh: There are infinite compact $K$ for which $C(K)$ is a dual space: these are precisely the hyperstonean $K$, e.g., $betamathbb{N}$. (On the other hand there are non-dual $C(K)$ for which the unit ball is the norm-closed convex hull of its extreme points, e.g. $alphamathbb{N}$. These are precisely the totally disconected $K$.)
– Dirk Werner
yesterday




@TarasBanakh: There are infinite compact $K$ for which $C(K)$ is a dual space: these are precisely the hyperstonean $K$, e.g., $betamathbb{N}$. (On the other hand there are non-dual $C(K)$ for which the unit ball is the norm-closed convex hull of its extreme points, e.g. $alphamathbb{N}$. These are precisely the totally disconected $K$.)
– Dirk Werner
yesterday










2 Answers
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active

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up vote
7
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No. Let $X$ and $Y$ be Banach spaces, and set $Z=Xoplus Y$, with $||(x,y)||:=|x|+|y|$. Assume that $x$ is a extreme point of $X$ with $|x|=1$. Then $(x,0)$ becomes an extreme point of $Z$; indeed, if
$$(x,0)=frac12(a,y)+frac12(b,z)$$
for $(a,y),(b,z)$ in the unit ball of $Z$, we then have $a=x=b$, since $x$ is an extreme point, but then $1=|x|=|a|leq||(a,y)||leq 1$, so $y=0$, and analogously, $z=0$.



So, $L^2(mathbb R)oplus L^1(mathbb R)$, is not a dual space, but its unit ball has extreme points.






share|cite|improve this answer



















  • 1




    How can we prove that $L^2(mathbb R)oplus L^1(mathbb R)$ is not a dual space?
    – Idonknow
    yesterday






  • 1




    @Idonknow This is because, $Xoplus Y$ is dual iff both $X$ and $Y$ are dual.
    – Meisam Soleimani Malekan
    yesterday






  • 3




    @MeisamSoleimaniMalekan: I am not absolutely positive about your previous comment: Write $C[0,1]^*$ as $L_1[0,1] oplus_1 Y$ with $Y=$ singular measures w.r.t. the Lebesgue measure. So a dual can have a non-dual $ell_1$-direct summand. My argument: If $L_2oplus L_1$ were a dual, it would, being separable, have the RNP, and hence $L_1$ would have the RNP, which it doesn't.
    – Dirk Werner
    yesterday










  • @DirkWerner Thanks for the comment, you are right!
    – Meisam Soleimani Malekan
    yesterday


















up vote
7
down vote













Every separable Banach space $X$ can be equivalently renormed so that every point in the unit sphere is an extreme point: Take an injective bounded linear operator $T$ from $X$ into $ell_2$ and use $|x| := |x|_X + |Tx|_2$. Of course, there are many separable Banach spaces that are not isomorphic to a separable conjugate space, including (as Dirk pointed out) those that fail the Radon Nikodym property.






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    2 Answers
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    2 Answers
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    up vote
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    No. Let $X$ and $Y$ be Banach spaces, and set $Z=Xoplus Y$, with $||(x,y)||:=|x|+|y|$. Assume that $x$ is a extreme point of $X$ with $|x|=1$. Then $(x,0)$ becomes an extreme point of $Z$; indeed, if
    $$(x,0)=frac12(a,y)+frac12(b,z)$$
    for $(a,y),(b,z)$ in the unit ball of $Z$, we then have $a=x=b$, since $x$ is an extreme point, but then $1=|x|=|a|leq||(a,y)||leq 1$, so $y=0$, and analogously, $z=0$.



    So, $L^2(mathbb R)oplus L^1(mathbb R)$, is not a dual space, but its unit ball has extreme points.






    share|cite|improve this answer



















    • 1




      How can we prove that $L^2(mathbb R)oplus L^1(mathbb R)$ is not a dual space?
      – Idonknow
      yesterday






    • 1




      @Idonknow This is because, $Xoplus Y$ is dual iff both $X$ and $Y$ are dual.
      – Meisam Soleimani Malekan
      yesterday






    • 3




      @MeisamSoleimaniMalekan: I am not absolutely positive about your previous comment: Write $C[0,1]^*$ as $L_1[0,1] oplus_1 Y$ with $Y=$ singular measures w.r.t. the Lebesgue measure. So a dual can have a non-dual $ell_1$-direct summand. My argument: If $L_2oplus L_1$ were a dual, it would, being separable, have the RNP, and hence $L_1$ would have the RNP, which it doesn't.
      – Dirk Werner
      yesterday










    • @DirkWerner Thanks for the comment, you are right!
      – Meisam Soleimani Malekan
      yesterday















    up vote
    7
    down vote













    No. Let $X$ and $Y$ be Banach spaces, and set $Z=Xoplus Y$, with $||(x,y)||:=|x|+|y|$. Assume that $x$ is a extreme point of $X$ with $|x|=1$. Then $(x,0)$ becomes an extreme point of $Z$; indeed, if
    $$(x,0)=frac12(a,y)+frac12(b,z)$$
    for $(a,y),(b,z)$ in the unit ball of $Z$, we then have $a=x=b$, since $x$ is an extreme point, but then $1=|x|=|a|leq||(a,y)||leq 1$, so $y=0$, and analogously, $z=0$.



    So, $L^2(mathbb R)oplus L^1(mathbb R)$, is not a dual space, but its unit ball has extreme points.






    share|cite|improve this answer



















    • 1




      How can we prove that $L^2(mathbb R)oplus L^1(mathbb R)$ is not a dual space?
      – Idonknow
      yesterday






    • 1




      @Idonknow This is because, $Xoplus Y$ is dual iff both $X$ and $Y$ are dual.
      – Meisam Soleimani Malekan
      yesterday






    • 3




      @MeisamSoleimaniMalekan: I am not absolutely positive about your previous comment: Write $C[0,1]^*$ as $L_1[0,1] oplus_1 Y$ with $Y=$ singular measures w.r.t. the Lebesgue measure. So a dual can have a non-dual $ell_1$-direct summand. My argument: If $L_2oplus L_1$ were a dual, it would, being separable, have the RNP, and hence $L_1$ would have the RNP, which it doesn't.
      – Dirk Werner
      yesterday










    • @DirkWerner Thanks for the comment, you are right!
      – Meisam Soleimani Malekan
      yesterday













    up vote
    7
    down vote










    up vote
    7
    down vote









    No. Let $X$ and $Y$ be Banach spaces, and set $Z=Xoplus Y$, with $||(x,y)||:=|x|+|y|$. Assume that $x$ is a extreme point of $X$ with $|x|=1$. Then $(x,0)$ becomes an extreme point of $Z$; indeed, if
    $$(x,0)=frac12(a,y)+frac12(b,z)$$
    for $(a,y),(b,z)$ in the unit ball of $Z$, we then have $a=x=b$, since $x$ is an extreme point, but then $1=|x|=|a|leq||(a,y)||leq 1$, so $y=0$, and analogously, $z=0$.



    So, $L^2(mathbb R)oplus L^1(mathbb R)$, is not a dual space, but its unit ball has extreme points.






    share|cite|improve this answer














    No. Let $X$ and $Y$ be Banach spaces, and set $Z=Xoplus Y$, with $||(x,y)||:=|x|+|y|$. Assume that $x$ is a extreme point of $X$ with $|x|=1$. Then $(x,0)$ becomes an extreme point of $Z$; indeed, if
    $$(x,0)=frac12(a,y)+frac12(b,z)$$
    for $(a,y),(b,z)$ in the unit ball of $Z$, we then have $a=x=b$, since $x$ is an extreme point, but then $1=|x|=|a|leq||(a,y)||leq 1$, so $y=0$, and analogously, $z=0$.



    So, $L^2(mathbb R)oplus L^1(mathbb R)$, is not a dual space, but its unit ball has extreme points.







    share|cite|improve this answer














    share|cite|improve this answer



    share|cite|improve this answer








    edited yesterday

























    answered yesterday









    Meisam Soleimani Malekan

    1,1041311




    1,1041311








    • 1




      How can we prove that $L^2(mathbb R)oplus L^1(mathbb R)$ is not a dual space?
      – Idonknow
      yesterday






    • 1




      @Idonknow This is because, $Xoplus Y$ is dual iff both $X$ and $Y$ are dual.
      – Meisam Soleimani Malekan
      yesterday






    • 3




      @MeisamSoleimaniMalekan: I am not absolutely positive about your previous comment: Write $C[0,1]^*$ as $L_1[0,1] oplus_1 Y$ with $Y=$ singular measures w.r.t. the Lebesgue measure. So a dual can have a non-dual $ell_1$-direct summand. My argument: If $L_2oplus L_1$ were a dual, it would, being separable, have the RNP, and hence $L_1$ would have the RNP, which it doesn't.
      – Dirk Werner
      yesterday










    • @DirkWerner Thanks for the comment, you are right!
      – Meisam Soleimani Malekan
      yesterday














    • 1




      How can we prove that $L^2(mathbb R)oplus L^1(mathbb R)$ is not a dual space?
      – Idonknow
      yesterday






    • 1




      @Idonknow This is because, $Xoplus Y$ is dual iff both $X$ and $Y$ are dual.
      – Meisam Soleimani Malekan
      yesterday






    • 3




      @MeisamSoleimaniMalekan: I am not absolutely positive about your previous comment: Write $C[0,1]^*$ as $L_1[0,1] oplus_1 Y$ with $Y=$ singular measures w.r.t. the Lebesgue measure. So a dual can have a non-dual $ell_1$-direct summand. My argument: If $L_2oplus L_1$ were a dual, it would, being separable, have the RNP, and hence $L_1$ would have the RNP, which it doesn't.
      – Dirk Werner
      yesterday










    • @DirkWerner Thanks for the comment, you are right!
      – Meisam Soleimani Malekan
      yesterday








    1




    1




    How can we prove that $L^2(mathbb R)oplus L^1(mathbb R)$ is not a dual space?
    – Idonknow
    yesterday




    How can we prove that $L^2(mathbb R)oplus L^1(mathbb R)$ is not a dual space?
    – Idonknow
    yesterday




    1




    1




    @Idonknow This is because, $Xoplus Y$ is dual iff both $X$ and $Y$ are dual.
    – Meisam Soleimani Malekan
    yesterday




    @Idonknow This is because, $Xoplus Y$ is dual iff both $X$ and $Y$ are dual.
    – Meisam Soleimani Malekan
    yesterday




    3




    3




    @MeisamSoleimaniMalekan: I am not absolutely positive about your previous comment: Write $C[0,1]^*$ as $L_1[0,1] oplus_1 Y$ with $Y=$ singular measures w.r.t. the Lebesgue measure. So a dual can have a non-dual $ell_1$-direct summand. My argument: If $L_2oplus L_1$ were a dual, it would, being separable, have the RNP, and hence $L_1$ would have the RNP, which it doesn't.
    – Dirk Werner
    yesterday




    @MeisamSoleimaniMalekan: I am not absolutely positive about your previous comment: Write $C[0,1]^*$ as $L_1[0,1] oplus_1 Y$ with $Y=$ singular measures w.r.t. the Lebesgue measure. So a dual can have a non-dual $ell_1$-direct summand. My argument: If $L_2oplus L_1$ were a dual, it would, being separable, have the RNP, and hence $L_1$ would have the RNP, which it doesn't.
    – Dirk Werner
    yesterday












    @DirkWerner Thanks for the comment, you are right!
    – Meisam Soleimani Malekan
    yesterday




    @DirkWerner Thanks for the comment, you are right!
    – Meisam Soleimani Malekan
    yesterday










    up vote
    7
    down vote













    Every separable Banach space $X$ can be equivalently renormed so that every point in the unit sphere is an extreme point: Take an injective bounded linear operator $T$ from $X$ into $ell_2$ and use $|x| := |x|_X + |Tx|_2$. Of course, there are many separable Banach spaces that are not isomorphic to a separable conjugate space, including (as Dirk pointed out) those that fail the Radon Nikodym property.






    share|cite|improve this answer

























      up vote
      7
      down vote













      Every separable Banach space $X$ can be equivalently renormed so that every point in the unit sphere is an extreme point: Take an injective bounded linear operator $T$ from $X$ into $ell_2$ and use $|x| := |x|_X + |Tx|_2$. Of course, there are many separable Banach spaces that are not isomorphic to a separable conjugate space, including (as Dirk pointed out) those that fail the Radon Nikodym property.






      share|cite|improve this answer























        up vote
        7
        down vote










        up vote
        7
        down vote









        Every separable Banach space $X$ can be equivalently renormed so that every point in the unit sphere is an extreme point: Take an injective bounded linear operator $T$ from $X$ into $ell_2$ and use $|x| := |x|_X + |Tx|_2$. Of course, there are many separable Banach spaces that are not isomorphic to a separable conjugate space, including (as Dirk pointed out) those that fail the Radon Nikodym property.






        share|cite|improve this answer












        Every separable Banach space $X$ can be equivalently renormed so that every point in the unit sphere is an extreme point: Take an injective bounded linear operator $T$ from $X$ into $ell_2$ and use $|x| := |x|_X + |Tx|_2$. Of course, there are many separable Banach spaces that are not isomorphic to a separable conjugate space, including (as Dirk pointed out) those that fail the Radon Nikodym property.







        share|cite|improve this answer












        share|cite|improve this answer



        share|cite|improve this answer










        answered yesterday









        Bill Johnson

        24.1k367116




        24.1k367116






























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