Prob. 2 (e), Sec. 27 in Munkres' TOPOLOGY, 2nd ed: Open supersets and $epsilon$-neighborhoods of closed...
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This question concerns exercise 2(e) from section 27 (p.177) in Munkres' Topology:
Let $(X,d)$ be a metric space, and let $A$ be a non-empty subset of $X$.
- For any point $x in X$, we define $$d(x, A) := inf { d(x,a) colon a in A }.$$
- For $epsilon > 0$ we define the $epsilon$-neighbourhood of $A$ in $X$ to be the set $$U (A,epsilon) := { x : d(x,A) < epsilon }.$$
- (d) Assume that $A$ is compact; let $U$ be an open set containing $A$. Show that some $epsilon$-neighborhood of $A$ is contained in $U$.
- (e) Show the result in (d) need not hold if $A$ is closed but not compact.
My effort:
Consider the set $mathbb{N}$ in $mathbb{R}$ with the usual metric. Then $mathbb{N}$ is closed, but not bounded and hence not compact. Let the set $U$ be given by
$$U colon= bigcup_{n in mathbb{N}} left( n - frac{1}{2n}, n + frac{1}{2n} right). tag{Definition 1 } $$
This set $U$ is an open set containing $mathbb{N}$. We also note that set $U$ is a union of disjoint open intervals.
Now let $epsilon $ be any positive real number.
Let us first choose $epsilon$ such that $0 < epsilon < frac{1}{2}$. Then by Part (c) of this problem, we can show that
$$ U(mathbb{N}, epsilon) = bigcup_{nin mathbb{N}} (n-epsilon, n+epsilon). tag{2}$$
And so we have
$$ U(mathbb{N}, epsilon) notsubseteqq U. tag{3} $$
To see why , let us choose a natural number $N > frac{1}{2epsilon}$. Then $epsilon > frac{1}{2N}$, and so the open interval $left( N-epsilon, N+epsilon right)$ is not contained in the open interval $left( N - frac{1}{2N}, N+frac{1}{2N} right)$; moreover the latter open interval is the only one of the disjoint open intervals in set $U$ [Please refer to (Definition 1) above.] which has a point in common with the former open interval. Since the open interval $left( N-epsilon, N+epsilon right)$ is contained in $U(mathbb{N}, epsilon)$, we can conclude that (3) does indeed hold.
Now for any real $epsilon > 0$, we can a choose a real number $delta$ such that
$$ 0 < delta < min left{ epsilon, frac{1}{2} right}. $$
Then
$$ U ( mathbb{N}, epsilon ) = bigcup_{n in mathbb{N} } big( n-epsilon, n+epsilon big) supset bigcup_{n in mathbb{N} } big( n-delta, n+delta big) = U( mathbb{N}, delta ). $$
Note that $0 < delta < frac{1}{2}$.
And, by (3) as
$$ U(mathbb{N}, delta) notsubseteqq U, $$
so we can also conclude that $$ U( mathbb{N}, epsilon ) notsubseteqq U $$
either.
Is this example a suitable one?
general-topology metric-spaces
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add a comment |
$begingroup$
This question concerns exercise 2(e) from section 27 (p.177) in Munkres' Topology:
Let $(X,d)$ be a metric space, and let $A$ be a non-empty subset of $X$.
- For any point $x in X$, we define $$d(x, A) := inf { d(x,a) colon a in A }.$$
- For $epsilon > 0$ we define the $epsilon$-neighbourhood of $A$ in $X$ to be the set $$U (A,epsilon) := { x : d(x,A) < epsilon }.$$
- (d) Assume that $A$ is compact; let $U$ be an open set containing $A$. Show that some $epsilon$-neighborhood of $A$ is contained in $U$.
- (e) Show the result in (d) need not hold if $A$ is closed but not compact.
My effort:
Consider the set $mathbb{N}$ in $mathbb{R}$ with the usual metric. Then $mathbb{N}$ is closed, but not bounded and hence not compact. Let the set $U$ be given by
$$U colon= bigcup_{n in mathbb{N}} left( n - frac{1}{2n}, n + frac{1}{2n} right). tag{Definition 1 } $$
This set $U$ is an open set containing $mathbb{N}$. We also note that set $U$ is a union of disjoint open intervals.
Now let $epsilon $ be any positive real number.
Let us first choose $epsilon$ such that $0 < epsilon < frac{1}{2}$. Then by Part (c) of this problem, we can show that
$$ U(mathbb{N}, epsilon) = bigcup_{nin mathbb{N}} (n-epsilon, n+epsilon). tag{2}$$
And so we have
$$ U(mathbb{N}, epsilon) notsubseteqq U. tag{3} $$
To see why , let us choose a natural number $N > frac{1}{2epsilon}$. Then $epsilon > frac{1}{2N}$, and so the open interval $left( N-epsilon, N+epsilon right)$ is not contained in the open interval $left( N - frac{1}{2N}, N+frac{1}{2N} right)$; moreover the latter open interval is the only one of the disjoint open intervals in set $U$ [Please refer to (Definition 1) above.] which has a point in common with the former open interval. Since the open interval $left( N-epsilon, N+epsilon right)$ is contained in $U(mathbb{N}, epsilon)$, we can conclude that (3) does indeed hold.
Now for any real $epsilon > 0$, we can a choose a real number $delta$ such that
$$ 0 < delta < min left{ epsilon, frac{1}{2} right}. $$
Then
$$ U ( mathbb{N}, epsilon ) = bigcup_{n in mathbb{N} } big( n-epsilon, n+epsilon big) supset bigcup_{n in mathbb{N} } big( n-delta, n+delta big) = U( mathbb{N}, delta ). $$
Note that $0 < delta < frac{1}{2}$.
And, by (3) as
$$ U(mathbb{N}, delta) notsubseteqq U, $$
so we can also conclude that $$ U( mathbb{N}, epsilon ) notsubseteqq U $$
either.
Is this example a suitable one?
general-topology metric-spaces
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Your question contained a lot of stuff that wasn't really relevant to the specific question you were asking. Please try to make your questions concise. (No need to even mention every part of a multi-part question if you are only going to ask about one part.)
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– user642796
Jul 5 '15 at 16:00
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@user642796 thank you for your comment, but I've only included Part (d) in addition to Part (e), and that too only for reference. You see, this particular problem has FIVE parts!
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– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 19:26
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@user642796 can you please have a look at my post now? I've just added some more detail.
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 20:07
add a comment |
$begingroup$
This question concerns exercise 2(e) from section 27 (p.177) in Munkres' Topology:
Let $(X,d)$ be a metric space, and let $A$ be a non-empty subset of $X$.
- For any point $x in X$, we define $$d(x, A) := inf { d(x,a) colon a in A }.$$
- For $epsilon > 0$ we define the $epsilon$-neighbourhood of $A$ in $X$ to be the set $$U (A,epsilon) := { x : d(x,A) < epsilon }.$$
- (d) Assume that $A$ is compact; let $U$ be an open set containing $A$. Show that some $epsilon$-neighborhood of $A$ is contained in $U$.
- (e) Show the result in (d) need not hold if $A$ is closed but not compact.
My effort:
Consider the set $mathbb{N}$ in $mathbb{R}$ with the usual metric. Then $mathbb{N}$ is closed, but not bounded and hence not compact. Let the set $U$ be given by
$$U colon= bigcup_{n in mathbb{N}} left( n - frac{1}{2n}, n + frac{1}{2n} right). tag{Definition 1 } $$
This set $U$ is an open set containing $mathbb{N}$. We also note that set $U$ is a union of disjoint open intervals.
Now let $epsilon $ be any positive real number.
Let us first choose $epsilon$ such that $0 < epsilon < frac{1}{2}$. Then by Part (c) of this problem, we can show that
$$ U(mathbb{N}, epsilon) = bigcup_{nin mathbb{N}} (n-epsilon, n+epsilon). tag{2}$$
And so we have
$$ U(mathbb{N}, epsilon) notsubseteqq U. tag{3} $$
To see why , let us choose a natural number $N > frac{1}{2epsilon}$. Then $epsilon > frac{1}{2N}$, and so the open interval $left( N-epsilon, N+epsilon right)$ is not contained in the open interval $left( N - frac{1}{2N}, N+frac{1}{2N} right)$; moreover the latter open interval is the only one of the disjoint open intervals in set $U$ [Please refer to (Definition 1) above.] which has a point in common with the former open interval. Since the open interval $left( N-epsilon, N+epsilon right)$ is contained in $U(mathbb{N}, epsilon)$, we can conclude that (3) does indeed hold.
Now for any real $epsilon > 0$, we can a choose a real number $delta$ such that
$$ 0 < delta < min left{ epsilon, frac{1}{2} right}. $$
Then
$$ U ( mathbb{N}, epsilon ) = bigcup_{n in mathbb{N} } big( n-epsilon, n+epsilon big) supset bigcup_{n in mathbb{N} } big( n-delta, n+delta big) = U( mathbb{N}, delta ). $$
Note that $0 < delta < frac{1}{2}$.
And, by (3) as
$$ U(mathbb{N}, delta) notsubseteqq U, $$
so we can also conclude that $$ U( mathbb{N}, epsilon ) notsubseteqq U $$
either.
Is this example a suitable one?
general-topology metric-spaces
$endgroup$
This question concerns exercise 2(e) from section 27 (p.177) in Munkres' Topology:
Let $(X,d)$ be a metric space, and let $A$ be a non-empty subset of $X$.
- For any point $x in X$, we define $$d(x, A) := inf { d(x,a) colon a in A }.$$
- For $epsilon > 0$ we define the $epsilon$-neighbourhood of $A$ in $X$ to be the set $$U (A,epsilon) := { x : d(x,A) < epsilon }.$$
- (d) Assume that $A$ is compact; let $U$ be an open set containing $A$. Show that some $epsilon$-neighborhood of $A$ is contained in $U$.
- (e) Show the result in (d) need not hold if $A$ is closed but not compact.
My effort:
Consider the set $mathbb{N}$ in $mathbb{R}$ with the usual metric. Then $mathbb{N}$ is closed, but not bounded and hence not compact. Let the set $U$ be given by
$$U colon= bigcup_{n in mathbb{N}} left( n - frac{1}{2n}, n + frac{1}{2n} right). tag{Definition 1 } $$
This set $U$ is an open set containing $mathbb{N}$. We also note that set $U$ is a union of disjoint open intervals.
Now let $epsilon $ be any positive real number.
Let us first choose $epsilon$ such that $0 < epsilon < frac{1}{2}$. Then by Part (c) of this problem, we can show that
$$ U(mathbb{N}, epsilon) = bigcup_{nin mathbb{N}} (n-epsilon, n+epsilon). tag{2}$$
And so we have
$$ U(mathbb{N}, epsilon) notsubseteqq U. tag{3} $$
To see why , let us choose a natural number $N > frac{1}{2epsilon}$. Then $epsilon > frac{1}{2N}$, and so the open interval $left( N-epsilon, N+epsilon right)$ is not contained in the open interval $left( N - frac{1}{2N}, N+frac{1}{2N} right)$; moreover the latter open interval is the only one of the disjoint open intervals in set $U$ [Please refer to (Definition 1) above.] which has a point in common with the former open interval. Since the open interval $left( N-epsilon, N+epsilon right)$ is contained in $U(mathbb{N}, epsilon)$, we can conclude that (3) does indeed hold.
Now for any real $epsilon > 0$, we can a choose a real number $delta$ such that
$$ 0 < delta < min left{ epsilon, frac{1}{2} right}. $$
Then
$$ U ( mathbb{N}, epsilon ) = bigcup_{n in mathbb{N} } big( n-epsilon, n+epsilon big) supset bigcup_{n in mathbb{N} } big( n-delta, n+delta big) = U( mathbb{N}, delta ). $$
Note that $0 < delta < frac{1}{2}$.
And, by (3) as
$$ U(mathbb{N}, delta) notsubseteqq U, $$
so we can also conclude that $$ U( mathbb{N}, epsilon ) notsubseteqq U $$
either.
Is this example a suitable one?
general-topology metric-spaces
general-topology metric-spaces
edited Dec 12 '18 at 20:06
Saaqib Mahmood
asked Jul 5 '15 at 15:35
Saaqib MahmoodSaaqib Mahmood
7,72242478
7,72242478
$begingroup$
Your question contained a lot of stuff that wasn't really relevant to the specific question you were asking. Please try to make your questions concise. (No need to even mention every part of a multi-part question if you are only going to ask about one part.)
$endgroup$
– user642796
Jul 5 '15 at 16:00
$begingroup$
@user642796 thank you for your comment, but I've only included Part (d) in addition to Part (e), and that too only for reference. You see, this particular problem has FIVE parts!
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 19:26
$begingroup$
@user642796 can you please have a look at my post now? I've just added some more detail.
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 20:07
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Your question contained a lot of stuff that wasn't really relevant to the specific question you were asking. Please try to make your questions concise. (No need to even mention every part of a multi-part question if you are only going to ask about one part.)
$endgroup$
– user642796
Jul 5 '15 at 16:00
$begingroup$
@user642796 thank you for your comment, but I've only included Part (d) in addition to Part (e), and that too only for reference. You see, this particular problem has FIVE parts!
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 19:26
$begingroup$
@user642796 can you please have a look at my post now? I've just added some more detail.
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 20:07
$begingroup$
Your question contained a lot of stuff that wasn't really relevant to the specific question you were asking. Please try to make your questions concise. (No need to even mention every part of a multi-part question if you are only going to ask about one part.)
$endgroup$
– user642796
Jul 5 '15 at 16:00
$begingroup$
Your question contained a lot of stuff that wasn't really relevant to the specific question you were asking. Please try to make your questions concise. (No need to even mention every part of a multi-part question if you are only going to ask about one part.)
$endgroup$
– user642796
Jul 5 '15 at 16:00
$begingroup$
@user642796 thank you for your comment, but I've only included Part (d) in addition to Part (e), and that too only for reference. You see, this particular problem has FIVE parts!
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 19:26
$begingroup$
@user642796 thank you for your comment, but I've only included Part (d) in addition to Part (e), and that too only for reference. You see, this particular problem has FIVE parts!
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 19:26
$begingroup$
@user642796 can you please have a look at my post now? I've just added some more detail.
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 20:07
$begingroup$
@user642796 can you please have a look at my post now? I've just added some more detail.
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 20:07
add a comment |
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
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Your example is fine. Another simple one, which I think allows to visualize what happens, is as follows: let $A={(x,0)| xin mathbb{R}}$ the real line embedded in $mathbb{R}^2$. Then let $$U := {(x,y)| |y|< frac{1}{|x|}}$$ (with the convention $1/0 := infty$) the region between the graphs of $pm 1/x$. The graph of $1/x$ approaches $A$ as $xrightarrow infty$, so that no neighbourhood of $A$ with diameter bounded from below will fit into it.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
your using the convention $1/0 colon= infty$ makes your argument appear to be not rigorous enough. Don't you think so? So can you please modify your argument to just avoid using any such thing.
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Oct 2 '18 at 11:34
$begingroup$
@SaaqibMahmood I just means that for $x=0$ there is no restriction for $y$, i.e. $(0, y)in U $ for every $y$. I do not see what's not rigourous about that.
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– Thomas
Oct 2 '18 at 12:39
$begingroup$
can you review my post again after I've edited it to include some more detail?
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 20:08
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Yes, your example is nice. (If $0notinmathbb N$.)
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
could you please take time going through my post once again? I've tried to be more thorough in my explanation.
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 20:10
add a comment |
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2 Answers
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2 Answers
2
active
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$begingroup$
Your example is fine. Another simple one, which I think allows to visualize what happens, is as follows: let $A={(x,0)| xin mathbb{R}}$ the real line embedded in $mathbb{R}^2$. Then let $$U := {(x,y)| |y|< frac{1}{|x|}}$$ (with the convention $1/0 := infty$) the region between the graphs of $pm 1/x$. The graph of $1/x$ approaches $A$ as $xrightarrow infty$, so that no neighbourhood of $A$ with diameter bounded from below will fit into it.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
your using the convention $1/0 colon= infty$ makes your argument appear to be not rigorous enough. Don't you think so? So can you please modify your argument to just avoid using any such thing.
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Oct 2 '18 at 11:34
$begingroup$
@SaaqibMahmood I just means that for $x=0$ there is no restriction for $y$, i.e. $(0, y)in U $ for every $y$. I do not see what's not rigourous about that.
$endgroup$
– Thomas
Oct 2 '18 at 12:39
$begingroup$
can you review my post again after I've edited it to include some more detail?
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 20:08
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Your example is fine. Another simple one, which I think allows to visualize what happens, is as follows: let $A={(x,0)| xin mathbb{R}}$ the real line embedded in $mathbb{R}^2$. Then let $$U := {(x,y)| |y|< frac{1}{|x|}}$$ (with the convention $1/0 := infty$) the region between the graphs of $pm 1/x$. The graph of $1/x$ approaches $A$ as $xrightarrow infty$, so that no neighbourhood of $A$ with diameter bounded from below will fit into it.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
your using the convention $1/0 colon= infty$ makes your argument appear to be not rigorous enough. Don't you think so? So can you please modify your argument to just avoid using any such thing.
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Oct 2 '18 at 11:34
$begingroup$
@SaaqibMahmood I just means that for $x=0$ there is no restriction for $y$, i.e. $(0, y)in U $ for every $y$. I do not see what's not rigourous about that.
$endgroup$
– Thomas
Oct 2 '18 at 12:39
$begingroup$
can you review my post again after I've edited it to include some more detail?
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 20:08
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Your example is fine. Another simple one, which I think allows to visualize what happens, is as follows: let $A={(x,0)| xin mathbb{R}}$ the real line embedded in $mathbb{R}^2$. Then let $$U := {(x,y)| |y|< frac{1}{|x|}}$$ (with the convention $1/0 := infty$) the region between the graphs of $pm 1/x$. The graph of $1/x$ approaches $A$ as $xrightarrow infty$, so that no neighbourhood of $A$ with diameter bounded from below will fit into it.
$endgroup$
Your example is fine. Another simple one, which I think allows to visualize what happens, is as follows: let $A={(x,0)| xin mathbb{R}}$ the real line embedded in $mathbb{R}^2$. Then let $$U := {(x,y)| |y|< frac{1}{|x|}}$$ (with the convention $1/0 := infty$) the region between the graphs of $pm 1/x$. The graph of $1/x$ approaches $A$ as $xrightarrow infty$, so that no neighbourhood of $A$ with diameter bounded from below will fit into it.
answered Jul 5 '15 at 15:47
ThomasThomas
16.8k21631
16.8k21631
$begingroup$
your using the convention $1/0 colon= infty$ makes your argument appear to be not rigorous enough. Don't you think so? So can you please modify your argument to just avoid using any such thing.
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Oct 2 '18 at 11:34
$begingroup$
@SaaqibMahmood I just means that for $x=0$ there is no restriction for $y$, i.e. $(0, y)in U $ for every $y$. I do not see what's not rigourous about that.
$endgroup$
– Thomas
Oct 2 '18 at 12:39
$begingroup$
can you review my post again after I've edited it to include some more detail?
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 20:08
add a comment |
$begingroup$
your using the convention $1/0 colon= infty$ makes your argument appear to be not rigorous enough. Don't you think so? So can you please modify your argument to just avoid using any such thing.
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Oct 2 '18 at 11:34
$begingroup$
@SaaqibMahmood I just means that for $x=0$ there is no restriction for $y$, i.e. $(0, y)in U $ for every $y$. I do not see what's not rigourous about that.
$endgroup$
– Thomas
Oct 2 '18 at 12:39
$begingroup$
can you review my post again after I've edited it to include some more detail?
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 20:08
$begingroup$
your using the convention $1/0 colon= infty$ makes your argument appear to be not rigorous enough. Don't you think so? So can you please modify your argument to just avoid using any such thing.
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Oct 2 '18 at 11:34
$begingroup$
your using the convention $1/0 colon= infty$ makes your argument appear to be not rigorous enough. Don't you think so? So can you please modify your argument to just avoid using any such thing.
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Oct 2 '18 at 11:34
$begingroup$
@SaaqibMahmood I just means that for $x=0$ there is no restriction for $y$, i.e. $(0, y)in U $ for every $y$. I do not see what's not rigourous about that.
$endgroup$
– Thomas
Oct 2 '18 at 12:39
$begingroup$
@SaaqibMahmood I just means that for $x=0$ there is no restriction for $y$, i.e. $(0, y)in U $ for every $y$. I do not see what's not rigourous about that.
$endgroup$
– Thomas
Oct 2 '18 at 12:39
$begingroup$
can you review my post again after I've edited it to include some more detail?
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 20:08
$begingroup$
can you review my post again after I've edited it to include some more detail?
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 20:08
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Yes, your example is nice. (If $0notinmathbb N$.)
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
could you please take time going through my post once again? I've tried to be more thorough in my explanation.
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 20:10
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Yes, your example is nice. (If $0notinmathbb N$.)
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
could you please take time going through my post once again? I've tried to be more thorough in my explanation.
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 20:10
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Yes, your example is nice. (If $0notinmathbb N$.)
$endgroup$
Yes, your example is nice. (If $0notinmathbb N$.)
answered Jul 5 '15 at 15:40
Eclipse SunEclipse Sun
7,5021437
7,5021437
$begingroup$
could you please take time going through my post once again? I've tried to be more thorough in my explanation.
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 20:10
add a comment |
$begingroup$
could you please take time going through my post once again? I've tried to be more thorough in my explanation.
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 20:10
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could you please take time going through my post once again? I've tried to be more thorough in my explanation.
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 20:10
$begingroup$
could you please take time going through my post once again? I've tried to be more thorough in my explanation.
$endgroup$
– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 20:10
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$begingroup$
Your question contained a lot of stuff that wasn't really relevant to the specific question you were asking. Please try to make your questions concise. (No need to even mention every part of a multi-part question if you are only going to ask about one part.)
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– user642796
Jul 5 '15 at 16:00
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@user642796 thank you for your comment, but I've only included Part (d) in addition to Part (e), and that too only for reference. You see, this particular problem has FIVE parts!
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– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 19:26
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@user642796 can you please have a look at my post now? I've just added some more detail.
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– Saaqib Mahmood
Dec 12 '18 at 20:07